Post from Hi, I'm Joe.:
Problems with the Dem's "100 hours" student loan proposals
Bad? Brilliant?
You can rate this post.
Register or login now and
tell us what you think.
From Brian Riedl over at National Review.

Riedl's critique makes good sense to me - if the goal was really to help make college more affordable, it seems like they'd be more likely to target something else.

What about expanding these SMART grants? Sounds like the perfect way for the government to get involved to me - I want the government to be helping to make college more affordable, but not if the kids are going to become Comparative Literature majors. Incentivizing the hard sciences and critical language skills makes good sense, and that's what our government should be focusing on.

Same with raising the minimum wage, an inane and meaningless gesture - if congress really wants to help people, they should be boosting the Earned Income Tax Credit instead.

Reader Comments
  
one-sided
By Paz Jan 17th 2007 at 12:56 am EST
I don't know. You have a point, but both what they are doing and what you are suggesting would only be half-solutions, if that. I think both are necessary. I for one am studying Religion and Political Science, with hopes of going to seminary and doing and doing advocacy work. With my student loans, the last thing i need are high interest rates.

And the minimum wage increase is a good thing - the minimum wage hasn't been worth this little in a long while. But, once again, that's only half a solution.
Re: one-sided
By Superduperficial Jan 17th 2007 at 11:19 am EST
I for one am studying Religion and Political Science, with hopes of going to seminary and doing and doing advocacy work. With my student loans, the last thing i need are high interest rates.



Why should the government be subsidising that? What we need as a nation are more hard science students and more experts on languages critical to our security.

You may feel like pursuing whatever degree you want, but from the federal government's perspective not all degrees are valued equally.



And the minimum wage increase is a good thing - the minimum wage hasn't been worth this little in a long while. But, once again, that's only half a solution.



The existence of a minimum wage itself is, at least in the present day, not a good thing, most economists agree.
minimum wage
By eva Jan 17th 2007 at 11:49 am EST
"The existence of a minimum wage itself is, at least in the present day, not a good thing, most economists agree."

Really now? Most economists?

"Hundreds of Economists support the Minimum Wage"
Link

"Economists call for minimum wage to be raised"
Link

"Higher minimum wage no longer seen as US job killer"
Link

"WalMart calls for minimum wage hike"
Link

Be careful before you generalize.
Re: one-sided
By jr Jan 17th 2007 at 10:07 pm EST
Do most economists live on minimum wage?

Have most economists ever worked for minimum wage?

Look, the minimum wage remained stagnant for the last decade, real wages have fallen, and we still saw substantial inflation. Let's stop scapegoating the one measure the government can take to help workers cope with inflationary pressure.
  
Reidl for the most part
By Liberaltarian Jan 17th 2007 at 9:57 am EST
is spot-on with his comment on the student aid/tuition correlation, and if we want to reduce tuition across the board, we need some downward pressure on the market. The most feasible option would be for states to really step up to the plate and fund public university higher education to the point where the "sticker price" can be reduced (or at the very least not go up). Of course that also means the Federal government has to pitch in and actually fund all those mandates they've thrown at the state capitols and said they'd fund.

That being said, I know personally that I took interest rates into serious consideration when making my education decisions. The margin of difference between the current rate and the new one very likely may mean, for example, more law school students being able to afford to become public interest/community legal services lawyers (though a Federal LRAP would go much further).
Re: Reidl for the most part
By Superduperficial Jan 17th 2007 at 11:21 am EST
That being said, I know personally that I took interest rates into serious consideration when making my education decisions. The margin of difference between the current rate and the new one very likely may mean, for example, more law school students being able to afford to become public interest/community legal services lawyers (though a Federal LRAP would go much further).



But we can target these things! I'm all in favor of cutting someone's interest rate to 1% if they'll sign a contract to slug it out for the little guy for 5-7 years.

Didn't Wisconsin start doing this recently?

Cutting interest rates is a fine tool if it's targetted to make sure we, the people, are getting Return on Investment.
  
not a silver spoon, try platinum
By Southern Progress Jan 17th 2007 at 2:34 pm EST
Yes--to raise the minimum wage "is an inane and meaningless measure"... that'll only immediately affect over 7 million citizens. After all it's pretty damn clear that Minimum wage is plenty for those greedy Americans.


Incidentally, it’s interesting this concern about small business. It'd make much more sense if you had the same criticism regarding Wal-Mart. But then again those who stand behind Wal-Mart the most have and will never work there themselves.

You talk about government subsidization regarding one end of the spectrum. But realize this: we're also paying for Wal-mart employee's health care just as we also happen to be subsidizing Big Oil even if we ride a bike all our lives.

In your world I'm sure that minimum wage is a trivial matter. In any event one thing is absolutely certain. The framing of this issue has NOTHING to do with any intellectual superiority. That's pretty damn clear
Re: not a silver spoon, try platinum
By Superduperficial Jan 17th 2007 at 3:58 pm EST
Supporting the minimum wage is the first sign that someone isn't really serious about helping America's poor - the EITC is an infinitely better way to help the people who need it, and that's what should be increased.
Re: not a silver spoon, try platinum
By jr Jan 17th 2007 at 11:32 pm EST
Hilzoy makes a great argument why EITC should be used in conjunction with, not instead of, the minimum wage. Link

And you can take your self-importance and shove it--anyone who's ever studied migrant farm wages knows that the EITC isn't going to do shit to help them, and that expanding the minimum wage to cover agricultural workers is the first step towards providing them with anything better than the slave wages they currently make. So don't give me that "isn't really serious" crap--it's just you using another derogatory phrase to put down an idea with which you don't agree and, like always, it makes you look like a dismissive, closed-minded dilettante.
Re: not a silver spoon, try platinum
By Superduperficial Jan 18th 2007 at 3:38 am EST

And you can take your self-importance and shove it--anyone who's ever studied migrant farm wages knows that the EITC isn't going to do shit to help them, and that expanding the minimum wage to cover agricultural workers is the first step towards providing them with anything better than the slave wages they currently make. So don't give me that "isn't really serious" crap--it's just you using another derogatory phrase to put down an idea with which you don't agree and, like always, it makes you look like a dismissive, closed-minded dilettante.



I don't see a problem with the wages migrant farm workers currently make. If you do, care to justify why? I see a problem with the working conditions in some places, sure, but there's no such thing as "slave wages" - their labor is worth what someone's willing to pay for it.

If the wages aren't worthwhile, migrant farm workers are free not to, well, migrate.

I'll get to the Hilroy piece in a bit.
Re: not a silver spoon, try platinum
By jr Jan 18th 2007 at 6:22 pm EST
Yeah, I'm sure Napa is lovely and all for grape-pickers, but I know a few tomato pickers from Immokalee, FL who work for pennies while exposed to pesticides and unsanitary living conditions. It takes them two tons of picked tomatoes to make $50, as each 32-lb bucket nets them a whopping forty cents. (A good segment by Amy Goodman on the subject of Immokalee farmworkers can be heard here. Link )

Nowadays, farms are either all consolidated in an area under one corporate entity that has uniformly abyssmal wages, or those few growers in a given area collude to keep wages down. That's a textbook market failure, and needs to be corrected to protect workers from unfair business practices. When you put your faith in market forces and then ignore the pollution of those forces by corrupt practices, you make a mockery of the market.
  
time to renew subscription
By Southern Progress Jan 17th 2007 at 3:14 pm EST
Hey...so long as it's in the National Review it must make sense to Progressives....
Re: time to renew subscription
By Superduperficial Jan 17th 2007 at 7:54 pm EST
At the core of any fundamental understanding of American politics lies the truth that America seriously benefits from the interplay of multiple ideologies.

In other words: One can be a progressive or a liberal without clinging to foolish notion that progressives and liberals are always right and that conservatives bring nothing intelligent or necessary to a policy debate. America works best when smart people of different ideologies keep each other honest.

If anything, I'd say as a liberal I benefit more from reading the National Review than I do the American Prospect. Similarly, I'd imagine a smart conservative getting more out of TAP, Democracy, TNR, or the writings of Christopher Hitchens than out of their own house organs.
  
Campus Progress

Please remember that Campus Progress' terms of use do not allow promoting or endorsing any particular political party or candidate for office. Posts or comments that do this will be deleted.

Campus Progress